Nephilim, the Book of Enoch, and lingering questions…

Yesterday I was listening to a really interesting interview done by Derek Gilbert, who spoke with Guy Malone about the topic of the Nephilim, and how this rather peculiar topic has started to become the source of an alarming amount of contention in certain circles.  Guy’s work deals mainly with people afflicted by various elements of the UFO phenomenon, but since there has been so many people who have connected ufology and the concept of modern-day nephilim, he has ended up doing a lot of research and teaching on that issue as well.  He talks about how before he had been in a place of putting a lot of credance to the book of Enoch, making use of all the typical biblical arguments (the quote from Jude, for instance…), but now after several years has had to make some changes to his perspective.  He shares about how some Christians have actually come to the sad place of rigorously debating whether or not “modern nephilim” can be saved… (!?)  Something which honestly sounds pretty dang “out there”, even to someone like me…

Interestingly enough a lot of what he had to say about Enoch have more or less been directions that I’ve found myself gravitating towards lately as well.  I initially was really blown away when I read about the “Watchers”, and the accounts of how they married human women and created their own little kingdoms, with themselves being more or less god-kings, and how they taught mankind the arts of war, and seduction, and sorcery, and all the rest…   So in the interview Guy talks about how he’s had to go back, and rethink his acceptance of the book of Enoch as being not canonical, but still having some kind of weight.   He refers to a video he helped produce called “The Case Against the Book of Enoch”, (seen below) which I then sat down and watched.

I will say that there was a great deal of info in this presentation that I found really helpful and informative.  They go to great lengths to explain the many places where the Book of Enoch does’t jive with the Old Testament, and also spend a lot of time to show that in fact the Book of Enoch is not even needed in order to have evidence for things like the Sons of God marrying the daughters of men, their hybrid (giant) offspring, or even the judgement of the Nephilim and their fallen angel fathers as they were thrown into the Abyss. 

The section where they get into the idea of the “principle of replication” was extremely interesting as well, where they go into explaining their case for the idea that while man and woman come together to create a new life, it is from the father that the spirit is passed down from.  Though it may sound a little strange at first, such a concept really would seem to make sense when considering how the Nephilim were both partially physically human, but spiritually speaking they were as fallen as their fathers.  (It also makes a lot of sense when you think about things like the virgin birth…)

However, as I continued on through the video, and then later took some looks through more of their material online, the thing that puzzles me is that after all of this exteremely thorough treatment of Enoch, as it compares to scripture (which all sounded pretty convincing), they then go on to talk about how the nephilim that were around after the flood (such as the giants in Canaan when Joshua and the spies went in) weren’t really true “nephilim” at all, but only people who happened to inherit a recessive gene for giantism, that must have been passed down through either Noah’s wife or his daughters-in-law.  They try to explain that the true “Nephilim” and the later “Rephaim” are distinct from one another, and so how this concept of their being any true fallen-angel-descended nephilim after the flood is erroneous… 

I guess in some ways I can maybe understand why Guy might feel swayed to come to such a conclusion, particularly after bearing witness to more and more people who are now making these pretty bizarre conclusions about how the gospel doesn’t apply to certain people today because they are (or at least believe they are) modern-day nephilim…

The only thing that trips me up with this however, is the fact that when we read Genesis 6:4, it plainly says, “The Nephilim were on the earth in those days–and also afterward–when the sons of God went to the daughters of men and had children by them.”  So if the nephilim before the blood were the progeny of fallen angels and human women, then it would that you’d have to say that the same thing were somehow also around after the flood too.  (Because, well, that’s just what it says!)

One of the things that really blew my mind when I first started to take seriously the whole concept of the “Genesis 6 paradigm”, was when I started then reflecting on how so much of the ancient mythology and pagan tradition has such a large amount of “overlap” with this concept, in the sense of the massively recurring themes of “gods” and demigods all over the world, legends of giants, and tales of beings that came down from the sky and gave civilization to men, etc.  From basically that point on, I have been unable to keep myself from wondering about just how much of those myths/legends were merely hand-me-down stories from the antediluvian era (with a “pro-demonic” spin of course…), and how much of this “mythology”, the worshipping of fallen angels and demons as “gods” over a particular city/kingdom, (in a very direct way) carried over into the generations after Noah…

When you look at things such as the building of the tower of Babel, the king Nimrod and the city of Babylon, it’s hard not to see that there appears to be a very similar out working of what we think of as occurring in the pre-flood days…  And if indeed the Israelite spies were seeing true, post-flood Nephilim when surveying the land of Canaan, then it sort of begs the question, did more angels fall, after the flood, and commit the same sins as before the flood?  That seems like it would be hard to understand, after God going through such trouble to wipe out the incredible sin and the genetic corruption that had covered the earth once before…

I guess for me the element of this whole “topic” that most seems like it has actual, here-and-now implications, is basically the question of whether or not  the current “Satanic echelon” is comprised of mostly or all demon-spirits (who very well could be the spirits of the deceased Nephilim…), or if fallen angelic hosts (who can exist as both ethereal spirits, or manifest into a physical body) are still a part of the mix…

Seems like part of the reason for so much ambiguity about this matter, is the fact that people can have all sorts of “encounters” which may be only happening in a spiritual sense, but which can seem every bit as real and tangible as every day life.  This is an aspect that people like Guy Malone obviously understand all too well, and so it would seem to make it difficult to ascertain if someone was every actually seeing a physically-manifested fallen angel, or just having type of psychic experience in which they believed they were seeing one…

I’d say a big reason that I never got too worked up about the notion of “modern-day nephilim” has to do with good ol’ Ephesians 6: “For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.”  To me, Nephilim would definitely seem to qualify as “flesh and blood”, and as such the Bible seems to negate the idea that at some point we’d have to worry about dealing with their ilk again.  Some people then of course look very closely at the whole genetic modification thing, and think that the “new” nephilim will have something to do with that, instead of the original angel-sired generation of nephilim, but I just don’t know…

One thing I really appreciated about Guy Malone’s approach to this topic, was how he went into detail on Matthew 24, and really took apart this popular notion that the phrase “As in the days of Noah, so shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man” means that there will again be Nephilim on the earth before Christ returns.  That sloppy interpretation has kind of bugged for a while, and it was good to see someone who is more “respected” in the field stand up and point that out…

Hmmmm.  I dunno….  I guess when I first came across it, the whole Nephilim thing seemed to really have a lot of significance (I guess the fact that Tom Horn was one of the first teachers I came across when researching the “NWO” probably played a part in that…), but now I’m just not quite sure what to think about it.  Maybe it’s not that significant after all.  Maybe, as the title of Derek’s interview alludes, there might be more distraction going on than any real threat…(?)

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Stick to the script!

Years ago I worked at a telemarketing company. Arguably the worst year and a half of my life. Towards the end of my stint there, I worked as a “team manager”, which basically meant I was responsible for firing people on an almost daily basis for not reaching their quotas, and for acting as the tireless policeman of the sacred words refered to as “the script”.

“Stick to the script” was the mantra. Deviation from the script was not tolerated. You don’t have to think about what to say, just stick to the script. You don’t have to concern yourself with fears that you may sound wooden, and superficial, and completely unbelievable to the person on the other end of the line, just stick to the script!

You see, at one point in time, someone within the company wrote the script, which was then passed on to the small army of telemarketers, who would call people at all hours of the day and night, and read the script.  The script contained exactly what the owners of the company wanted to be communicated over the phone.  That’s why telemarketing companies write scripts.  It keeps the pitch simple.  There is no need to complicate the pitch by having your telemarketers bumble it up with their own thought processes.  The idea is to keep the message simple and to the point, and then have it repeated over, and over, and over again.  That is the simple, horrifying beauty of the telemarketing script.  It actually works.  If you call enough people, and say the same, predetermined words enough times, you will get results.  All you have to do is stick to the script….

Today is July 3rd.  Tomorrow is July 4th.  Predictably, this means we are being told certain things, since tomorrow is a national holiday, and national holidays are obviously a prime target for would-be agents of terror.  Today, like so many other holiday-eves over the past decade, we hear familiar lines from a very familiar script… 

“According to intelligence and law enforcement officials, there is no specific terror threat for the holiday”

“While officials say no specific threats or terror plots have been discovered, they are stepping up security over concerns about so-called “lone wolves” and ongoing concern about al Qaeda”

“There are reports of concern over another terror plot involving Al Qaeda targeting a U.S. airliner, possibly timed to the London Olympic Games”

“we need to remind our citizens to be vigilant – to be aware of their surroundings…”

I must confess that I am growing exceedingly weary of hearing lines from this incredibly unoriginal script…

Every time we approach another national holiday, or big travel weekend, or 9/11 memorial, or the next Superbowl MCMLXXXIV, we hear the same litany of warnings;  There is an increase in terrorist “chatter”, but there is no specific threat, though we must remain vigilant, and we must report any suspicious activity, and of course there has been an increase in overall “security”…  If you see a bag left somewhere unattended, then you’d better report it.    Be prepared.  Have an emergency kit.  And by the way, enjoy your holiday!

The dutiful telemarketers of the media (also sometimes refered to as “reporters”) make sure the public receives a constant dose of “the pitch”.  We get our regular “courtesy calls”, reminding us that the threat is still very real and very serious.  Of course, the nefarious plotters of American doom aren’t hatching their schemes from caves in Afghanistan anymore, now their evil lair resides somewhere in Yemen and the Arabian peninsula.  They are like cockroaches, these terrorists, who scurry around filling whatever empty crevice they can find that would provide shelter.  That’s why we’re “monitoring” them so closely.  Now these crafty muslims are trying to recruit European and Asian looking individuals to serve as suicide bombers,  which is why we must now be even MORE vigilant, since apparently racial profiling won’t be as useful as it once was.  (pardon my excessive use of sarcasm there, couldn’t help it…)

The script which I constantly hear being read from in the media somehow makes the one I used to read from as a telemarketer sound like pullitzer-prize material by comparison.  By some amazing feat of creative marketing, the message has now been tailored to basically describe a terrorist mindset which has actually become ever so much more stupid and simplistic since the days of Sept., 2001…  Unlike then, when Bin Laden & Co. were in their prime and capable of masterminding an attack which was precisely timed to coincide with the lowering of our radar and air defense systems, nowadays the typical architect of destruction is apparently more inclined to just try leaving a suitcase full of explosives in a crowded place.  (maybe the NSA has detected “chatter” which indicates that Al Qaeda is just getting lazy…?)  Not only that, but it would seem that now the terrorists are so dim-witted that we don’t have to worry about tipping them off that we are on to their latest plot.  Right now we have just discovered that a Norwegian, “believed to be in his thirties and with no criminal record”, is their next intended infiltrator of the free world.  Maybe we don’t know everything about this newest recruit, but we know some:

“…intelligence agencies must now find an individual who fits the profile of an al Qaeda convert: “Someone 18 to 35, someone who is from Norway, someone who has traveled to places that are jump-off spots to go to Yemen. Now, you’ve got maybe tens of thousands of people, or thousands. But you want to crunch that down to who has connection somewhere else in the database, and focus on those people.”

Yep, we’re hot on his trail.  Do we have to worry that we may be inadvertently warning the Scandinavian jihadist that we are looking for him, as we broadcast these details on Good Morning America, just before the latest dish on Katy Perry?  Nope!  (Don’t be silly, Al Qaeda are muslims so they’re not allowed to watch anything with Katy Perry…)

What?  Shut up.  Just stick to the script…   

The only problem is that every script has a goal, an ending, a “close”…  Telemarketers do not call people up and interrupt them at the dinner table just in the hopes of having a nice chat.  The script is designed to take you somewhere you somewhere, to prepare the listener for whatever is coming at the end of the call.  The script of “homeland security” is no different.  These endless reminders to “be vigilant”, and that there is ongoing “concern” for yet another plot”, are all about keeping the public engaged in the message, in anticipation for some big close.  It’s like when you watch a news cast, or t.v. show, and for the better part of an hour, you are constantly being “teased” with the same brief clip, which they show before every commercial, but never let you see the whole thing until the very end…

Fortunately, my time spent in that modern purgatory known as a “call center” finally ended.  I slept in one morning, showed up two hours late, and got canned.  Never been so happy to be fired in all my life.  The company eventually folded, and last I heard was being investigated for engaging in unethical business practices.  And alhough I may not be spending any more soul-sucking hours in that dreadful place, I can still tell when someone is reading from a script, giving me a pitch, prepping me for the close…